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My ancestor Timothy Kelly, died in Weobley, Herefordshire, in 1839, and was born around 1774, according to the age given on his death certificate.

Supposedly, his son told descendants that his father was from Ireland, but we've been unable to find him there.

There is a Timothy Kelly born in Clerkenwell at around the right time, but there's just not enough evidence yet.

I'm wondering what resources I should check next to try to figure out where Timothy was born and who his parents were.

Most of the research has been done by my grandmother. Personally, I have done basic searches on Ancestry and FamilySearch, but that's all.

I have uploaded all of the images I have to his WeRelate page (linked above) and to his family page. I have marriage records for his first marriage, but they don't mention his parents. There is a record for his second marriage (Film #1,041,603), but I don't have the transcription, or an image. That was research done by my grandmother, so I'm sure it doesn't list parents' names either, or she would have noted it.

This marriage occurred at St Peter, Hereford, Herefordshire, but I can't find the St. Peter, Herefordshire Parish records online for this time period.

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    What resources have you checked already? That would help with suggestions on what to check next. Do you have his marriage? – Rob Hoare Oct 26 '12 at 23:50
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    I was wondering that too. If the marriage details mention the father than that would help. A mention of Ireland could have originated from a previous generation so the 24/Oct/1774 baptism in Clerkenwell cannot be ruled out. Does the death certificate mention any family member as informant? His death is just short of a census but I wonder if the electoral registers might have caught him. findmypast hope to publish ones from 1832 next year and they might help you to track the possibilities. Is the death certain? There was a Timothy Kelly b. c1776 in Ireland still alive in the 1841 census. – ACProctor Oct 27 '12 at 18:18
  • The death is certain - I have the death certificate (image is on his WeRelate page) – Jeremy Oct 28 '12 at 15:02
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    findmypast has the image of the 1808 marriage. No parents mentioned. Witnesses were John Higgins and Louise Atkins. – ACProctor Oct 28 '12 at 19:09
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    So it appears the source for the "Ireland" story is the 1880 US census for a John P Kelley in American Fork, where he says his father was born in Ireland. Whether this is actually the son of Timothy isn't totally clear, since with the same family in the 1870 census there's a son who does not match the age of the son born back in England (1861 census). Plus, the werelate page shows a second marriage (and bunch of children from 1868's), yet in the 1870 and 1880 censuses he's still living with the first wife. I think there's more than one John P Kelly, needs a fresh look. – Rob Hoare Oct 28 '12 at 22:17
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Does the previous research include source citations? When was it done? What resources were available then? Were original rescords consulted or indexes. Bear in mind that previous work may not be correct, so it is a good idea to verify it.

Whilst online records are very accessible and can yield results quickly, only a tiny proportion of records are online. The original parish registers should be in the county record office.

The informant on the death certificate was the attending doctor. He may not have accurately know the age, so try a range of dates in your searches.

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On my family group sheet, it has Timothy Kelly being born in 1777 in Weobley, Herefordshire, England, or Ireland. Married 14 January 1808 at St. James Picadilly, Westminster, Middlesex, England. Died 11 January 1839 in Weobley, Hereford, England. This information was taken from the Family Search program put out by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.


As you can see in the Bishop's Transcript (viewable at Ancestry.com) below the Marriage between Timothy Kelly and Lucy Lindeman appears to have taken place on 12 January 1808 at St. James Picadilly, Westminster, Middlesex, England by License (L).

enter image description here


enter image description here

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    Hi, Colleen, welcome to G&FH.SE! I don't understand what you mean by "the FamilySearch program". Where exactly did you see this information? You don't give enough information for someone to be able to look at the information themselves. – Jan Murphy Apr 3 '18 at 3:19
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    @JanMurphy I suspect the source is FamilySearch.org – ColeValleyGirl Apr 3 '18 at 7:20
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    @ColeValleyGirl Yes, but "I saw it on FamilySearch.org" is still too vague to be of any use. I'd like to encourage people to cite exactly what they saw. Was it FamilySearch FamilyTree? Something in the historical records? A user-submitted genealogy? Something else? As you know, there are many possibilities. – Jan Murphy Apr 3 '18 at 18:05
  • I'm sorry, but it's been too long since I found the information. I believe I Googled Timothy Kelly's name to find out what I did. The document was created by Ray and Leona Kelly of Sparks, Nevada, if that will help. I still haven't found anything to tell me about the early days of Timothy, before moving to England. – Colleen Porter Apr 4 '18 at 10:32
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Eaton Bishop, Herefordshire Parish Register, Baptisms, MX 152

16 Sept. 1785 Lucy dau. John and Harriot Lindeman and William son of said John and Harriot Lineman was bapt.

Timothy Kelly's First marriage:

The 1808 marriage was in St James Westminster as was correctly stated an is confirmed from the B. T. entry on ancestry together with an image and it should be noted that they were married by Licence.

His first wife was buried in Bromyard, Herefordshire: Bromyard B.T.'s MX16

21st Dec 1814 Lucy Kelley of Bromyard, aged 28 was bur.

He then married for a second time.

St Peters, Hereford, Marriages, refs. MX 165,

26 Dec 1815 Timothy Kelly of Bromyard, a widower and Fanny Eckley of St Peter's Hereford a Spinster, were married by license in the presence of William George and Kenneth Eckley.

Piggot's Herefordshire Directory 1830

Weobley Professional Person's

Kelly, Timothy, Academy.

Piggot's Herefordshire Directory 1835

Weobley, Grammar School, Kelly, Timothy, Master.

Weobley Parish register

19 Dec 1830 Francis Ann dau. of Timothy Kellly and Frances was bapt.

This death is recorded:

Weobley Herefordshire, Parish Register, Burials

16th Jan 1839 Timothy Kelly of Weobley, aged 63 was buried.

Deaths, Timothy Kelly, Weobley, Herefordshire, Jan-Feb-mar 1839, 26, 208.

Weobley Parish Register Burials, Herefordshire Mx146

16 Jan 1839 Timothy Kelly of Weobley, aged 63, was buried.

His second wife died in Bromyard:

Bromyard, Herefordshire, Parish Registers, burials

18 June 1842 Frances Kelly of Bromyard, aged 59, was buried.

Deaths, Frances Kelley(sic) Apr-May-Jun 1842, Bromyard, Herefordshire, 26, 106.

Timothy Kelly, may well have been Irish, claim that he may have been born in Weobley in not confirmed from the Weobley parish register. It would be worthwhile to ascertain if he was a Dublin Graduate or not in this instance. From which to attempt to extend the family line back.

There is a reference to a Timothy Kelly on the 1841 census Finsbury, St Giles in the Field's HO 107/673/16 and his wife Joana Kelly. Clearly this cannot be the same person as the person as required in by you in this instance since he was buried in Weobley, Herefordshire in 1839 as above.

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    What is the database ID of the relevant database on Ancestry? What do they give as the source of the original records? Could you add the source citation information to your answer? – Jan Murphy Apr 8 '18 at 17:53
  • I already did as you should have seen. I did not use ancestry. As I do not think that most of these Herefordshire records are on Ancestry or indeed on-line. I used the microfilm of the Parish registers in Herefordshire Archives. You can look them up by Parish and see what Parish Register coverage they have on their website. But as stated most of them are not on-line. – sean007 Apr 8 '18 at 18:14
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    Your answer says "The 1808 marrage in St James Westminster is confirmed on ancestry with an image and it is noted that they were married by Licence." Where did that information come from? – Jan Murphy Apr 9 '18 at 6:09
  • Well look it up an ancestry and you will see it. For yourself. – sean007 Apr 20 '18 at 1:13
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    You say "The 1808 marrage in St James Westminster is confirmed on ancestry with an image" so it seems reasonable to me that @JanMurphy has politely asked whether you are able to provide a link to the image that you have mentioned. Your first comment seems to contradict the first sentence of your answer as to whether you have seen the image on Ancestry. – PolyGeo Apr 20 '18 at 7:50

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